Newbie totally blown away...

[Drakken]

I received my copy of DW today and I feel a little intimidated. I started to read the Training part of the manual on my CD and I was totally blown away by the complexity. Of course I did expect it to be complex, but I still feel so hopeless (like so many newbies) that I don't know where to start.

So the question is, where to start to learn? :redface:

[TLAM Strike]

I say start with the MH-60R Seahawk. Its the simplest platform to learn. Then move on to eather the P-3 or the Subs saving the FFG for last.

[SKeeM]

I say pick the platform you like the most and just play till you learn it. Just dont give up when it seems like your not getting anywere. It is a huge learning curve and it does get very frutrating in the begining. And ask all the questions you want here. youll get answers. The best thing about this game is it has a mature community. Mostly older gentelmen of a higher intelect.

[Furia]

If you are really interested to learn not only about the game but about Naval Warfare I can recommand you to join one of the actual virtual Fleets.

I can just speak for SEAWOLVES (http://www.seawolves.org/) but there I can tell you they will teach you from the very simple to the most complex stuff.
There you can also have as much as you want Multiplayer combats.
For learning all the stuff about the P-3, the unbeateable site you have to visit is ORION WARRIOR (http://www.orionwarrior.com/html/)

If you do not want to get into realism details then you can play with simple settings and learn.
The game also came with good video tutorials , I believe they are on Disk number 2 and they will teach you the very basics of the game.
Just one warning note. Naval warfare is highly addictive :arms: so be aware that once you begun to learn the trade of the sim and sea warfare you will be condemned to have endless hours of challenge, fun ,tension and you will meet really strange people on the internet that spend hours listening the broadband frecuencies trying to get a solution on an enemy target. :tongue:
Here in this forum you will also find all the help you need and on this Naval comunity you will always find people willing to explain you whatever you need.

WARNING:This simulator is considered illegal and highly dangerous by the International Wives and Girlfriends Association.

[Drakken]

As counseled, I play Quick Missions with the MH-60R to train myself. I must admit that the first thing I want to learn is how to use the Sonobuoys and how to read the sonar charts. However, it's hard to remember the difference between VLADs, DICASSs and DICARs.

Also, how can I identify what my sensors detect? I know that yellow squares are what my ownship is detecting, but even in visual I cannot put a name on what I detect. :feedback:

Finally, how the hell can a Cruise ship be hostile?

[OneShot]

As far as dealing with the buoys and stuff goes, I recommend to read the P-3C Orion Manual available in the Guides Download forum. It deals primarily with the P-3 but lots of stuff, for example use of Sonobuoys and the MAD can be used with the Helo as well. To identify a contact you can either look at it, and if you have a reasonable idea you can look up the USNI (ESC key -> USNI) or if you have the contact on a sonobuoy you can use the library feature. If you click on that button you can browse through the matching Narrowband profiles to the lines you get in the buoy.

And I recommend to take a look at the Sonar Training part of the manual which is pretty good.

[Drakken]

Also, is it me or does every single ship sighted in Quick Missions are fair game to be shot at?

[LuftWolf]

Well, in QM's nothing stops you from engaging every ship in the mission, however, it is intended to be played with the ships marked neutral with "show truth" on as non-hostile and thus off limits. But its YOUR game, you can play however you like! :smile:

[SKeeM]

When i first started playing i would kill evry contact just to practice my TMA work:eek: And to help clear up the screen from so many contacts.:biggrin:

[Drakken]

Well, in the QM I just played I was trying to tract a Chinese HAN SSN and sunk a HAI surface ship. It was loads of fun! :cool:

For the HAI it was simple, I saw it and sent a Penguin. It sank with one missile.

For the HAN, I succesfully identified him from the Library with my VLAD. I had narrowed the SSN in a tight spot in the Sea of China with my DICAR buoys, just to see another HAN spotted 10 nm wnw of my Ownship. I am sure it was the same SSN but spotted its exact position. And I wasted my two torpedoes on my false mark. :eek:

Lessons are: a) don't trust the VLAD as far as position and distance is concerned. I think. b) Don't break your hydrophone by pulling out too fast! :wink:

At least, it shows I am getting better with buoys.

[OneShot]

Well, I know why your location was off the mark. When you mark a contact on a buoy (unless its on active with a DICASS) you will always get a contact symbol at the end of a 10nm line which starts at the buoy. This is just the bearing but not the actual distance to the target. To get at least an approximate distance you need another buoy offset to the first one laterally and preferably vertically as well to give you another bearing line. Now where those two lines cross thats the approximate location of the target. Actually the point where those lines cross is the center of a circle - the area of probability. Within this area your target sub is somewhere. Depending on the location of your buoys and the distance to your target this area might be smalller or larger.

[Drakken]

So a good strategy would be, theorically, to search for such a cross of bearing, draw a circle of probability at the middle of the cross when it appears, and use the hydrophone in the middle of that circle to try to spot the sub, right?

[Molon Labe]

Use two or three VLADs, update the bearings on all of them, and put the torpedo where the bearing lines intersect.

VLAD does not give you range.

[Drakken]

Also, is there a way to merge my sensors on a foe when spotted in visual? Each time I spot an enemy on visual my sensors detect around it and blurry the aim of my missile.

[OneShot]

Unfortunatly (or lucky - depends on point of view) both the Helo and the P-3 do not come equipped with a TMA. This means no contact merging for us Airedales. Personally I just keep the things currently needed on the Nav map and delete or hide everything else (hide by ways of the right click menu). For example when I got a kill on a sub I delete the bearing lines I had on him.

As Molon Labe said, you can go with dropping a torpedo on the cross of two bearing lines. However this is not recommend. A better tactic is to have multiple locations tracked of the sub in intervals of 2 or so minutes (the + marker comes quite handy there, especially since you can enter the time on it). Based on those markers you can estimate course and speed, which leads to more reliable kills. This of course takes time, patience and sometimes luck.

So if you can afford the time, use it and make sure you hit the right guy the first time, without possible means of escape for him. If not, go with intuition and pray for luck. Tho you might end up hunting Whales or Shrimp or even worse kill someone from your side.

[LuftWolf]

OneShot really IS a one shot killer... you'll do well to listen closely to everything he has to say about the ways of the airdales.

[Drakken]

Gah!! :mad:

I receive a report about an enemy SSN by link, with High confidence. So I guess it means the SSN is indeed there and I rush to him with my Helo.

a) How the hell can I enter free view in my cockpit so that I can confirm or not the visual with my own eyes?

b) How come when I pass over the mark with my MAD sensor deployed, both at 200 ft and slow speed, I cannot detect the damn submarine?

c) I send buoys after buoys to try to spot him under the sea, even use the hydrophone to spot it, but none bounce any information back. Even a DICASS a few yards away from the Link mark senses nothing back.

d) Why does my Penguin missile always go astray when I fire it?

Questions, questions...

[Furia]

Gah!! :mad:

I receive a report about an enemy SSN by link, with High confidence. So I guess it means the SSN is indeed there and I rush to him with my Helo.

a) How the hell can I enter free view in my cockpit so that I can confirm or not the visual with my own eyes?

b) How come when I pass over the mark with my MAD sensor deployed, both at 200 ft and slow speed, I cannot detect the damn submarine?

c) I send buoys after buoys to try to spot him under the sea, even use the hydrophone to spot it, but none bounce any information back. Even a DICASS a few yards away from the Link mark senses nothing back.

d) Why does my Penguin missile always go astray when I fire it?

Questions, questions...

This is because Naval Warfare is an Art and not an exact science. :cool:

Unless you have Show true activated, all you see is pure guessing and deduction. Best way to verify this is to dip your sonar and go active. You also can drop a Dicass and make it active.
An active contact is very reliable, however, do not forget that targets move and what was here 5 minutes ago it could be one mile away when you reach. Check the AGE of the contacts reported by link :wink:

[SKeeM]

This is because Naval Warfare is an Art and not an exact science. :cool:

This is so true and is the reason i play naval sims. I am an ex tanker. I was a gunner on an M1 Abrams MBT. And i love land war games also but not as much as Naval games. The thing i always found truely amazing is how hard it is to wage war when there is nothing to hide behind. There are no mountians, forrest or urban cities to hide behind or in. But yet the vast amount of water provides the ultimate arena to prctice the art of war.

[Drakken]

Still, I would like people to answer my questions and give me some more advice. I'm a little confused. :)

The only answer I can formulate is that the visual wasn't a visual and that although the Link spotted the sub his signature was hidden by the layer.

[LuftWolf]

The links can sometimes be a bit off.

You have to do your own searching very carefully using the links as a guide.

I can give you some more exacting advice if you let me know what mission it was. :wink:

In general, the layer will have a huge effect in the game. If you are using the stock 1.02/3b database, then you are limited to 400ft search depth, which is above most layers.

This may be fixed in the official version.

Let me know what mission it was and I can give you some more specific advice, but if it was under a layer, and you were using the stock database with a 400ft depth max search for buoys and cables, then it is very likely it was under the layer and you did not see it.

[LuftWolf]

Gah!! :mad:

I receive a report about an enemy SSN by link, with High confidence. So I guess it means the SSN is indeed there and I rush to him with my Helo.

a) How the hell can I enter free view in my cockpit so that I can confirm or not the visual with my own eyes?

b) How come when I pass over the mark with my MAD sensor deployed, both at 200 ft and slow speed, I cannot detect the damn submarine?

c) I send buoys after buoys to try to spot him under the sea, even use the hydrophone to spot it, but none bounce any information back. Even a DICASS a few yards away from the Link mark senses nothing back.

d) Why does my Penguin missile always go astray when I fire it?

Questions, questions...

a) You can take the cockpit away by hitting the HUD looking rectangle in the pilots display near the top right.

b) You have to maintain at least 60-80kts when using the MAD so that it drags behind you. Also, if the sub is deep, it will not work, being deep is the standard way to avoid MAD detection

c) I answered above

d) Penguines are not great weapons. Your weapon could be getting spoofed or picking up another IR contact. Make sure your helo (and the missile seeker head) is pointed towards the target before you fire.

[Drakken]

Well... erhm... I sunk my first sub in QM tonight . A Ming SSN. The torpedo went strength to his hull. :arms:

[Drakken]

The links can sometimes be a bit off.

I can give you some more exacting advice if you let me know what mission it was. :wink:


It was a quick mission.

[LuftWolf]

Well... erhm... I sunk my first sub in QM tonight . A Ming SSN. The torpedo went strength to his hull. :arms:

Congradulations! :biggrin:

[JoGary]

Way i learned the subs in DW was to put on all the auto crews and jump right in there.:tongue: Then disable the Autocrews one by one as i got more confident i could do them better than the computer. My first 2 weeks of DW was spent in the nav map ordering couses and depth then right clicking and clicking engaging with to fire torps and missiles lol.:redface: Then once i got bored with that i learned the weapons controll room and started setting presets for my own torps. Then i went to sonar and learned that. I am now still learning TMA and guess i will never stop learning as far as DW and TMA is concerned.

[Drakken]

a) You can take the cockpit away by hitting the HUD looking rectangle in the pilots display near the top right.


Is there a way to be able to look on the sides? The HUD rectagle allows only to look straight ahead.

Also, how do you succeed to identify the visual when there are no photos available? :eek:

[Molon Labe]

When you're in the cockpit, there are "arrow" tabs on the sides that you can use to look out the windows.

[LuftWolf]

The helo automatically detects, marks, and classifies visual contacts when you are crewing it and when it is AI.

There is no need to see the contacts yourself unless you wish to wave. :smile:

[Drakken]

Way i learned the subs in DW was to put on all the auto crews and jump right in there.:tongue: Then disable the Autocrews one by one as i got more confident i could do them better than the computer. My first 2 weeks of DW was spent in the nav map ordering couses and depth then right clicking and clicking engaging with to fire torps and missiles lol.:redface: Then once i got bored with that i learned the weapons controll room and started setting presets for my own torps. Then i went to sonar and learned that. I am now still learning TMA and guess i will never stop learning as far as DW and TMA is concerned.

I tried the 688i once, and I didn't know what to do. I was so lost. :eek:

I will keep the learning of SSNs in MP, probably by joining a virtual fleet if they deem me worthy.