Realistic MP settings. Your Oppinion please

[Furia]

Lasts MP games we could see how different oppinion we do have about wich are the appropiate MP settings for a match.
This also made us waste like 15 minutes asking the Host to change this and this.
So this make me to propose here what based on my experience should be the most balanced and realistic settings for this matches.
Basically this is oriented for a match where players are manning one platform per player, that is single station.

Before going into details let me tell you I am a hardcore player, I hate arcade and I love realism to the max.
I have been playing Naval sism since the first Spectrum Silent hunter back in the 80's
I always aim for maximum realism like in Silent Hunter where I always use Manual TDC or 688i Hunter Killer where all was no Auto Crew or Sub Command.
Said this, on my experience I have come to realize that playing DW without NO Autocrew, not only does not bring realism but it complicates the game in a way it brings no benefit.
Actual DW Auto crew alone would never give you enough information and in proper time to kill a huma opponent. Maybe with some dumb AI you can but surely against humman, if you have to wait your Autocrew give you enough data on him you will be dead by then and this is a fact.
I believe Autocrew helps in some cases to keep information and processing flowing while you are cheking other stations.
I basically just play the FFG and on this complex platform this is basically a need. SO while I am manually on the TA defining contacts, I need the EW auto crew to warn me if there is a new threat painting me with a FC radar.
Or if I am shooting a SM-2 against an Air targte, I need the Sonar crew to keep track of the new accoustic data and to tell me if I have a hot buoy os such channel.
This is what happens on a real Ship. The Captain is coordinating all the effort but not micromanaging all stations at the same time.
I manually manage each and every station when I need to refine information, release a weapon or gather extra data but while I am on the acustic station filtereing frecuencies and so, I want my AutoTMA keep ploting of the contacts and my EW crew warn me if a warship just illuminated me.
On my oppinion having the Autocrew in some stations is not a cheat or is going to help me to gather better data on the enemy since actual Autocrew is by far low on perfomance than any average level player, but to keep me warned about new information that appear while I am in other station.
This is particulary important on the FFG where you have more stations than other platforms and where you have to be aware not only of submarine contacts but air contats and EW information and so. Where the Accoustic information could come from 3 different stations and so.
Subs are a bit different on this because while submerged and al slow speed, the Captain basically focus on the Sonar station Having basically all information he needs on this single station.
I know some will surely disagree with me because they usually only drive subs or because they believe that "hardcore" is using the "advanced" player settings that means no Auto Crew. I respect this but this is my oppinion as a hardcore player and a dedicated FFG driver.
Resuming it Autocrew on my oppinion is need in some stations not for doing your work but to keep track of things while you are away on other station. Autocrew does not provide enough accurate and in time data to fight succesfully a capable human opponent but helps to keep track of things while you are in other stations.
For this I propose to use this settings for MP games where one player mans one platform. For multistation games where severl players man one platform I propose NO AUTCREW in any way since players have the time to focus on their station.
This are my proposed settings.
http://menorca.infotelecom.es/~raulurbina/MP1.JPG
http://menorca.infotelecom.es/~raulurbina/MP2.JPG
http://menorca.infotelecom.es/~raulurbina/Mp3.JPG

I have thought about this very carefully before posting this here so please thought about it just one minute before it is wrong because it is not "advanced mode"
Anyway I will surely welcome any oppinions. As I said I basically drive FFG lalthough I have extensive experience on subs in 688i,Sub Command, Silent Hunter, Los Angeles, DW and other sims but for this MP experience on DW I prefer basically to speak for the FFG.

[Molon Labe]

I think playing with no autocrew is a little harsh. Some players call that "full realsim," but real ships have more than one crew member.

I think the best way to play is to allow autocrew functions that perform the menial, mechanical tasks, while leaving the skipper (you) to perform the tasks involving judgment. This way you can concentrate on what's important without, for example, having to run to the active intercept station to mark the pings yourself. Also, all the cheats should be off (quick launch, show dead platforms, TMA).

So, I think the autocrew that are acceptable are: Active intercept, Radar, ESM, and Countermeasures.

[SKeeM]

Well heres my :2ct: I myself only play in subs, 688 to be exact. I use auto active intercept and thats it. Evrything else i micro manage. But that is me. I think any player should have the rite to play the game the way he or she likes it best. The bottom line is we all play to have fun. There is no fun when 1 person dictates to another the proper way to play. The only problems i would have is show truth and show dead platforms. That to me is information the player shoud be forced to aquire on his own. If you hit a Boomer with 1 torp and hear the impact there is no garentee that he is dead. Its up to you the make that assesment. And you could verywell get hit by a torp from him trying to get that info. Samething applies to fireing a antiship missle over the horizon. There is no reason you should just be givin a confirmed kill. And if you expose yourself to another threat wile trying to aquire that info, Hey thats life:biggrin:

[OneShot]

Personally since I hardly drive anything besides the P-3 and the Helo, I would vote for the following settings for those two stations :
P-3 :
AC Countermesaures - ON
AC Radar - ON
Helo :
AC Countermeasures - ON
AC Radar - ON
Every other AC OFF.

Reason for this, the AC suck at the most important stations on the Airborne plattforms, means the Accoustics and the TACCO/ATO station. Those need to be handled by a player with judgement because the AI mindlessly marks all contacts on the buoys even if they are of no interest and its settings as far as TACCO/ATO go, well - they can be improved. But by all means, thats my way of playing, and I certainly dont want to force that on anyone. On the flipside, those ACs I listed are those I consider important. When I actually use the Radar, I dont want to spend my time marking contacts on the screen, the AI is more capable there. And as far as CM AC goes, well - the AI does a fairly good job there too, and I have other things on my mind in that situation. Since there is no TMA on either plattform thats not on my list, but my opinion on the aTMA is, that if somebody wants it, let him use it - whenever I drive a boat its one thing I dont want to mess with.

On the other settings I vote for Aircraft Quicklaunch enabled. If the FFG starts with the Helo still onboard it might take ages before its off use.

:soapbox: And as far as Deadplattforms go, well as long as their is the Status screen readily available there is no point in disabling them. The only thing I don't get then is a nice picture of the plattform I just killed, but I still get the info. And dont give me the stuff about finding out what happend yourself. In real life you can actually decide from your Accoustics input or lots of other sensors if you killed the target to a certain degree. You don't have that capability in the game. For example you can very well distinguish between an Active decoy and a moving sub in real life in the game thats a lot harder if not to say impossible, depending on which sensors you have nearby. So either put in all the capabilities you have in real life, then I can live without the Status Screen/Dead plattform showing or do me a favour and leave that option on. :gdamnit:

[Furia]

Just one question Oneshot.
Imagine you are flying the P3 alone, low and with you MAD activated. You are with autopilot and you have a frecuency alert set on your acustic station.
Now you are monitoring, lets say the IR Camera while your P-3 just overfly a submarine. If you have no autocrew you do not receive the MAD MAD warning, as far as I know you only have a light falshing on the MAD station on the notify button but nobody is there to notify:wink:
Same goes with frecuency alerts, if one of your buoys gets this frecuency, you will receive no acustic Frecuency Alert message but just on the Frecuency alert button would flash, but nobody is there to warn you.
On Real life the whole crew would learn about a MAD contact inmediately reported by the MAD sensor operator.
This is things which also happen on the FFG are the ones that after deep thinking made me get to the idea that for maximum realism, we need certain stations being "watched" if we are not there.
Other station like for instance firing torps on the FFG which it is a bit cumbersome, must be done manually, but while I am doing this I want to know that if a new contact sonar shows up while I am configuring torps, and triggers a frecuency alert or a buoy goes hot.
This is for me realism.
Anyway this thread is very interesting to know about everybody feeling about this.
I think we should think more careful about what we consider as realism because I guess sometimes we all confuse realism with complexity or dificulty.

[SKeeM]

Well i must that this is a good topic. because if there to be weekly games it would be a good idea to set a standerd of game settings. To save time like Furia pointed out. Just put a vote up. I belive the player should decide how much work they can handle on there own. I know some might think if someone has alot of auto crew working for them it would be the same as playing the AI. But its really not beacuse the player has the final word on any actions that will be taken by the platform.

[OneShot]

On the account of the MAD you are wrong. Regardless if you have the AC on the ESM/MAD station activated, the MAD will get marked on the NavMap and you will receive an audible warning including a message in the CrewComm Window "MAD! MAD! MAD!". Hence for this, there is no need for AC on this station. Actually the AC on the ESM station is counterproductive when the ESM is activated. It will mark all ESM contacts and if you move at high speed it will repeatedly mark the same contact without updating but generating a new LOB. Talk about cluttering up your Navmap. As for the frequency alerts, they work even without the AC (I just checked the P-3 OWTOP again to be sure). BUT the Frequency Alert works only on those buoys you have dialed in. Thats the good thing on the AC, it switches the active buoys around a lot so the Frequency Alarm is more effective. The little gain by using the Frequency Alerts together with AC is offset by the behavior of it when turned on which I have pointed out in my first post.

[TLAM Strike]

With the subs I play with only Active Intercept and TMA AC. Since on real subs (at least US ones) the AI system is automated and I suck at TMA.

On the helo I play with ESM and Countermeasure Auto crew.

P-3 ESM and Countermeasure.

I’m not that good with the FFG yet so I use TA, ESM, Countermesure, and TMA.

But I think that all players should be allowed to chose which AC they use, since not all players are on the same level.